De-accept the third person suggestion

[User 12049]

Firstly, there are multiple things that I had mentioned in the thread that go to show why 3rd should be disabled when only using a firearm.

My first point had been accuracy, which is increased to make recoil non-existent in the event that they right click while in third person. Lets be honest, you really think someone is going to not do that?

Secondly, there is the issue of having more than a 180 degree view. (Meaning you can see people sneaking up on you, and farther than you would realistically be able to see through first person.)

Thirdly, there is the issue of being able to look around corners, over walls and such without putting yourself in harms way. This is VERY unrealistic and only leads to the game of who wants to jump out of the corner first. It is frequently one of the main things that is abused in 3rd person and brings a sense of unfairness to combat.

My fourth point is the benefits of making first person combat the only option. Not only does it increase the realism, actually require a sense of skill but it also makes it so that people are going to be less likely to go on the oh-so-loved raids without an actual team. Making it first person is going to require teamwork (Covering different angles, watching your flanks) and make the whole system a LOT more fun.

I get that YOU have an issue with it, but myself and many others can agree that it is the smart thing to do. This is not a raiding server and thus you shouldn't be too concerned with a change occurring to make combat more realistic/difficult. 

 Your first point is false. The recoil is the same if you don't believe me scope in with first person and third person and you'll see they're the same.

Secondly, yes it's true that you get a bigger FOV, but this means there is more to look at. Due to this in First person you're able to see what you want to, while in third person you can see most of what is happening and most of what you see is not necessary.

Thirdly, this is true. But everyone can do this, I don't see what you don't like this even though you can do it. 

Forthly, this is mere personal opinion. I would prefer if we could all be third person because I find it more enjoyable, I don't see why I should have to lose what I enjoy so you gain what you do.

"I get that YOU have an issue with it, but myself and many others can agree that it is the smart thing to do. This is not a raiding server and thus you shouldn't be too concerned with a change occurring to make combat more realistic/difficult. "


Did you fail to see that 6 people disliked your thread because they didn't like the idea? So far most of your points have been invalid so I fail to see why you would comment on this. And to say that I shouldn't be 'too concerned' is rather hypocritical of you due to you being so concerned with third person to make a thread for the removal of it.


I feel this suggestion should not be accepted because I myself enjoy to play my game in third person, it's fair more enjoyable and as we could see from the other thread 50% felt the same way. To accept a thread that is so controversial is very unfair to the 50% that disagree because NO it wasn't just me half the server play in third person and to force them to only play in first person makes it like other severs.

[User 12049]

To meet the demands for that aesthetic desire for seeing yourself with a gun in third person, it may be possible to script it so that first person is enabled only when they are pointing the weapon. It might be possible to make it so that people could access third person when their weapon is pointed to the ground? This grants some players to enjoy that 3rd person view until they actually aim their weapon.

If it's possible I can agree to it.

Although I am very upset that third person has been disabled for shooting. I find 3rd person a lot better for Garry's Mod in general, find it hard using first.

A lot of people will be upset by this and I've always viewed first vs third as a personal choice. I doubt people go through the trouble of "abusing" it and it's just part of the game really. We've had it for years and no-one's really cared, why the sudden change?

This is what I am getting at. Some people will be upset for the removal of third person shooting. It's what I play Fearless for(Expect the RP). I feel that third person should be left how it is as we all have the same advantage.

[Baskingner]

I wouldn't like it neither if this is implemented. As far as i saw there was no majority for either +support/-support. I find it a bit weird that this is implemented though..
If 50%+ has no problem with this apperant "bug" why remove it?

As for your arguments Nevy, they might all be valid but it is your opinion if they weight up against the "disadvantages" of removing it. So even if you have 1000 valid arguments it is still a matter of discussion up for argumentation.

[User 12049]

THis is very true. I see no reason to remove this considering most people enjoy how it is, why remove something you enjoy.

[Smex]

It'll really suck turning it off, it's not like people abuse it? Wall banging is sort of a part of raiding, I myself don't do it as I don't use third person as I feel the accuracy is horrible and goes to the wrong angle, but wall banging to look around is a method. Unless you add the ability to poke your head around corners (leaning), then I feel the current "wall bang" system is okay.

Just my opinion, but it'll really cause some people to be upset about it, considering it's never gave anyone a advantage.

Everyone abuses it. This is the problem why raids last centuries, and why it should be removed. Neither is the problem wall banging but looking around walls to see whether they are coming or not. You never have to risk anything in a raid, by removing third person looking around corners then it actually puts a risk into a raid rather than who has a quicker firing gun and can hover a unrealistic crosshair over their target.


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[User 12049]

It'll really suck turning it off, it's not like people abuse it? Wall banging is sort of a part of raiding, I myself don't do it as I don't use third person as I feel the accuracy is horrible and goes to the wrong angle, but wall banging to look around is a method. Unless you add the ability to poke your head around corners (leaning), then I feel the current "wall bang" system is okay.

Just my opinion, but it'll really cause some people to be upset about it, considering it's never gave anyone a advantage.

Everyone abuses it. This is the problem why raids last centuries, and why it should be removed. Neither is the problem wall banging but looking around walls to see whether they are coming or not. You never have to risk anything in a raid, by removing third person looking around corners then it actually puts a risk into a raid rather than who has a quicker firing gun and can hover a unrealistic crosshair over their target.


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This is very true, but raids are still won. I have been in multiple raids and have won without any qwarm. All you do is bait their reload and then run. IF they have two weapons stop and shoot them in the head. Third person is a choice, if you don't like third person. Fine. But to make it so that others have to suffer also is unfair and shouldn't be allowed. 

[Jan]

Why take away a feature when clearly 50% if not more disagrees?

[Smex]

Firstly, there are multiple things that I had mentioned in the thread that go to show why 3rd should be disabled when only using a firearm.

My first point had been accuracy, which is increased to make recoil non-existent in the event that they right click while in third person. Lets be honest, you really think someone is going to not do that?

Secondly, there is the issue of having more than a 180 degree view. (Meaning you can see people sneaking up on you, and farther than you would realistically be able to see through first person.)

Thirdly, there is the issue of being able to look around corners, over walls and such without putting yourself in harms way. This is VERY unrealistic and only leads to the game of who wants to jump out of the corner first. It is frequently one of the main things that is abused in 3rd person and brings a sense of unfairness to combat.

My fourth point is the benefits of making first person combat the only option. Not only does it increase the realism, actually require a sense of skill but it also makes it so that people are going to be less likely to go on the oh-so-loved raids without an actual team. Making it first person is going to require teamwork (Covering different angles, watching your flanks) and make the whole system a LOT more fun.

I get that YOU have an issue with it, but myself and many others can agree that it is the smart thing to do. This is not a raiding server and thus you shouldn't be too concerned with a change occurring to make combat more realistic/difficult. 

 Your first point is false. The recoil is the same if you don't believe me scope in with first person and third person and you'll see they're the same.

Secondly, yes it's true that you get a bigger FOV, but this means there is more to look at. Due to this in First person you're able to see what you want to, while in third person you can see most of what is happening and most of what you see is not necessary.

Thirdly, this is true. But everyone can do this, I don't see what you don't like this even though you can do it. 

Forthly, this is mere personal opinion. I would prefer if we could all be third person because I find it more enjoyable, I don't see why I should have to lose what I enjoy so you gain what you do.

"I get that YOU have an issue with it, but myself and many others can agree that it is the smart thing to do. This is not a raiding server and thus you shouldn't be too concerned with a change occurring to make combat more realistic/difficult. "


Did you fail to see that 6 people disliked your thread because they didn't like the idea? So far most of your points have been invalid so I fail to see why you would comment on this. And to say that I shouldn't be 'too concerned' is rather hypocritical of you due to you being so concerned with third person to make a thread for the removal of it.


I feel this suggestion should not be accepted because I myself enjoy to play my game in third person, it's fair more enjoyable and as we could see from the other thread 50% felt the same way. To accept a thread that is so controversial is very unfair to the 50% that disagree because NO it wasn't just me half the server play in third person and to force them to only play in first person makes it like other severs.

See here where your logic falls, an attacker can not see someone defending, e.g The president, so if you was to look at the third floor, what makes it hell to raid is the fact that there are so many corners that the attackers have to get by that it makes it near impossible for them to do so, only by hours of raiding can you gradually do somethign as the defenders and raiders get impatient.... Is that what it should be like, that people have to actually get bored of what they are doing for them actually to get into action where they were not able to do anything before because the moment that they try to advance, poke there head out and actually raid someone see's their movements without them being able to see them. That is the significant problem of third person abuse.

[Nevy]

 Your first point is false. The recoil is the same if you don't believe me scope in with first person and third person and you'll see they're the same.

Incorrect. Scoping in 3rd person and 1st person are drastically different. Try scoping with an AK47 in both and see the difference. I don't know why you are saying this when we all know that 3rd person offers like a 400% increase in accuracy since recoil is not a factor, when scoping in first person is effecting by it.


Secondly, yes it's true that you get a bigger FOV, but this means there is more to look at. Due to this in First person you're able to see what you want to, while in third person you can see most of what is happening and most of what you see is not necessary.

Seeing more = an advantage that makes combat unrealistic. From the first person perspective you have to actually be more aware of your surroundings and would think twice about running into a dangerous situation alone. What I see as necessary is making it more realistic.

Thirdly, this is true. But everyone can do this, I don't see what you don't like this even though you can do it. 

Because it is unrealistic and abused. How many times do I find myself walking down a walkway only to have a guy pop around the corner, who knew I was coming through this method, to shoot me down.

Fourthly, this is mere personal opinion. I would prefer if we could all be third person because I find it more enjoyable, I don't see why I should have to lose what I enjoy so you gain what you do.

My main point was realism, something we should strive for as it makes gameplay experience more enjoyable for the majority of players. It is why we made car damage, bleeding, etcetera. Don't you find it hypocritical to call me out on saying that I am defending the suggestion because it is my personal preference, yet you are defending your points because it is your preference to play in third person? 

Did you fail to see that 6 people disliked your thread because they didn't like the idea? So far most of your points have been invalid so I fail to see why you would comment on this. And to say that I shouldn't be 'too concerned' is rather hypocritical of you due to you being so concerned with third person to make a thread for the removal of it.

You can defend your points but there is still abuse, in my opinion, so until that is fixed this is the solution. I personally love third person but want something that makes my experience more realistic and enjoyable. I am sure there are many ideas that have had negative support but have been accepted, depending on the suggestion. As this one deals with combating a method of player advantage, you should understand that. 

[Wood]

snip

What I'm trying to get at, is that I can't see any "unfair advantage" as the OP as claimed. I myself use first person most of the time, and I have no issue with people using third person at all, it really seems this suggestion has basically spoke for the minority of people that use first person and feel it's unfair.

There's not a advantage, as anyone is free to use it, it's only a advantage if a certain group can use it. As stated, I use first person yet I don't see any disadvantage using this, and I feel using third person is actually harder as it's inaccurate. It still does have recoil, as that's coded into the gun itself and the bullets move around, not just the POV.